UK Sex Offenders Claim It’s Against Islam to Talk About their Crimes
Yeah, they’ll play the Muslim Card any chance they can get, even if it means serving more time in prison…
H/T – Mullah Lodabullah
Muslim sex offenders could opt out of treatment because its against their faith
8 April 2008
DailyMail.co.uk
Muslim sex offenders may be allowed to opt out of a treatment programme because it is against their religion, it was revealed today.
The Prison Service’s Muslim advisor, Ahtsham Ali, has said there is a “legitimate Islamic position” that criminals should not discuss their crimes with others.
It could mean that Muslims convicted of sex attacks will attempt to avoid the Sex Offender Treatment Programme, which involves group discussions of their crimes.
Although Mr Ali has not yet proposed changes to the rules, he told prisoners’ newspaper Inside Time: “I will be taking it forward as a matter of some urgency with colleagues, including those with policy responsibility for the Sex Offender Treatment programme, who I know are very willing to consider and discuss these issues.”
The possibility of an exemption for Muslims came to light after an unnamed prisoner wrote to the newspaper asking to clarify the position of Muslims on the programme.
“I have always insisted that it was against Islamic teachings to discuss your offence to anyone, let alone act it out within a peer group,” the prisoner wrote.
[I must have missed that one in my studies of Islam... If anyone knows what the heck he is referencing, let us know. Could it be he just doesn't think he did anything wrong because he was dutifully following Muhammad's example?]
Mr Ali responded that the issue had been raised twice before but there had not yet been a review of the rules relating to the treatment programme.
A Prison Service spokeswoman said: “We are currently seeking to ensure that the policy for the Sex Offender Treatment Programme is sensitive to the diversity of religions within the prison context.
“The programme is suitable for any prisoner with a current or previous conviction for a sexual offence, or another offence which has an identifiable sexual element.
“Membership of a particular religion is not a bar to participation in accredited programmes.”
Editor of the Prisons Handbook, Mark Leech, said: “Muslims who don’t want to take part in the course may have to spend more time in prison, because their risk of reoffending will not be assessed as part of the treatment programme.
“This would be quite right, because we have to think about the victim.
“I think it is feasible there may be a judicial review so that Muslim sex offenders get a dispensation from the rules.
“There are precedents for allowing dispensations on cultural grounds – for example, wearing a crash helmet is the law but if you are a Sikh man you can have a dispensation from that rule.”
The Prison Service spokeswoman added: “As well as being suitable for the programme based on an analysis of their risk and need, offenders must be ready and willing to fully engage in the programme because the programme requires analysis of the offence.
“To assess an offender’s readiness, and to ensure that the programme is responsive to their particular needs, a range of factors are considered.
“These include intellectual ability, language, literacy, dyslexia, mental and physical health, disability, drug use and psychopathic traits, as well as religious or cultural issues.”
One expert said Muslim offenders who were forced to stay in prison longer because they refused to take part in the treatment could bring legal action against the Prison Service.
Assistant general secretary of probation union Napo, Harry Fletcher, said the situation presented an “intractable problem”.
“The logic is that Muslims cannot take part in offender programmes and therefore their offending behaviour cannot be assessed and they are unlikely to be granted parole.
“They may then seek legal redress through judicial review on the grounds that they are being discriminated against on the grounds of religion,” he said.
“If they do not take part, Muslim sex offenders are likely to serve longer sentences, possibly the whole of their term, before they are released.”
8 April, 2008 at 8:54 am
SEXUAL PERVERSION IN ISLAM? SAY IT AIN’T SO!
“Oooops. Heh heh heh. Move along. Nothing to see there. (especially, do NOT look at the bottom of that page below the smiling goat, pleeeeeez)” — Muckmudd Al Ghoul
8 April, 2008 at 8:58 am
Yonason,
That goat was HOT!
8 April, 2008 at 9:31 am
Most of the quirky things Muslims do or don’t do can be found in Shariah Law, a convenient English handbook for which is “The Reliance of the Traveller.” At the beginning of this 1230 page volume is the assertion that good and evil have nothing to do with reason, but rather they are based on what the Lawgiver (defined as Allah or his Prophet) has condoned or prohibited. (para. a1.4) In essence, anything that advances Islam relative to the infidels is good, and anything that interferes with the advance of Islam is bad.
In that context, section r35 forbids revealing one’s sins to others. The examples will astound anyone from a Judeo-Christian background. Sin is OK, as long as it is not committed openly. It would be offensive, then, to talk about a past sin because that would be “pulling away the cover” that Allah provided to conceal the sin.
While repentance is a process which involves only the sinner and Allah, the sinner may also discuss the problem with a sheikh or some other person who could offer religious guidance, prayers, and so forth. It is only offensive to reveal sins when so religious interest can be served.
Apparently, Allah provides opportunities to sin and then provides cover for the sin. (Surah 8:17) George Sale (translator of Keith Ellison’s swearing in Quran) observed regarding Arab Muslim criminal behavior, “And in relating their adventures of this kind, they think it sufficient to change the expression, and instead of ‘I robbed a man of such or such a thing,’ to say, ‘I gained it.’ ” (pg. 24)
8 April, 2008 at 9:35 am
That goat was HOT!
:-&
8 April, 2008 at 9:42 am
@Chris
That’s certainly consistant with their behavior.
8 April, 2008 at 9:53 am
This is why Islamania appeals to losers-those with deviant tendencies find a haven there. Not only that but those tendencies get a “religious” good seal of approval.
8 April, 2008 at 9:55 am
Most of the quirky things Muslims do or don’t do can be found in Shariah Law, a convenient English summary of which is “The Reliance of the Traveller.” This 1230 page volume begins by explaining that good and evil are not determined by reason but rather by what the Lawgiver (defined as Allah or his Prophet) allowed or prohibited. (para. a1.4) In essence, anything that advances Islam relative to infidels is good, and anything that impedes the advancement of Islam is bad.
Section r35 is about revealing one’s sins to others. The guidance will be astounding to anyone from a Judeo-Christian background. Sin is OK unless it is committed openly. Therefore, it would be offensive to confess a past sin because that would be, in effect, pulling away the cover that Allah provided to conceal it.
Any repentance for a sin is strictly between the perpetrator and Allah. However, one may discuss the problem with a sheikh or someone who could provide religious guidance, prayers, and so forth. But talking about it when no religious purpose can be served would be offensive.
Apparently, Allah provides opportunities to sin and then provides cover for those sins. (Surah 8:17) In view of this, Muslims may not even feel guilt over their evil acts. George Sale, the translator of the Keith Ellison’s swearing in Quran, made this observation about Arab Muslim criminal activities: “And in relating their adventures of this kind, they think it sufficient to change the expression, and instead of ‘I robbed a man of such or such a thing,’ to say, ‘I gained it.’ ” (pg. 24)
8 April, 2008 at 12:11 pm
Chris,
Thank you for helping me find the reference.
The Reliance of the Traveller
@R35.2
It seems to me that the prison officials are trying to help “teach” the sex offenders how to “desist” and “refrain” from their deviant behavior…
The sex offenders should just be glad that they didn’t get the “slave girl” treatment:
“Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.’ So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, ‘Tell the Apostle the truth.’” – Ishaq 496
8 April, 2008 at 12:48 pm
http://drsanity.blogspot.com/2005/08/shame-arab-psyche-and-islam.html
Dr Sanity has a great article on the difference between a shame based culture where you feel bad only if OTHERS think you did something wrong, regardless of whether you think you did something wrong.
In contrast, in a guilt based culture you feel bad when YOU think you did something wrong, regardless of whether others find out about it or not.
It’s a really great article.
8 April, 2008 at 5:29 pm
For crying out loud!
8 April, 2008 at 10:21 pm
VH,
The akismet Spam filter dumped your comment into the Spam folder. Sorry I didn’t see it until just now.
Cheers
8 April, 2008 at 10:39 pm
That’s cool I figured as much.
9 April, 2008 at 12:46 am
VH,
It did it again! What the heck is up with that?
10 April, 2008 at 12:05 am
Testing 1 2 3.
Sigh IDK I am having trouble commenting on other wordpress blogs Not just here.
10 April, 2008 at 11:50 am
VH,
Yup! You’re getting dumped into the SPAM folder! Do you need me to fire off an email to Matt at WordPress?
10 April, 2008 at 2:09 pm
Gosh Doc that would be awful nice of you to do so on my account.
I surely would appreciate it if you would.
10 April, 2008 at 2:25 pm
VH,
I contacted Akismet via their website and sent you an email.
Cheers
17 July, 2008 at 8:49 am
OMG!!!! You are so blinded by emotions that you can’t see or think logically. How on earth did you get that reasoning Chris from the text you displayed?????
Isn’t it obvious that the rulings stated in the text are in place to act as a deterrent. A sin is a sin and is judged as so. There is no covering up or indeed advocation of covering up in Islam. It is clear to me that was is meant here is simply to keep ones sins to oneself in the hope that others do not follow and god forbid think that it is ok to do the sin.
We are as humans known to absorb things around us. If, for example, one was in the company of 10 other muderers and each of them spoke about their sins wouldn’t it become the norm for them. The element of shock and shame is removed and replaced by normality and even acceptance. Islam teaches to repent for ones sins. lying is itself a sin and to conceal something can fall into this category. Something you conveniently left out was that one of the conditions for the repentance to be valid is to STOP THE SIN.
It does seem that DrBULLDOG had a point when he said
‘It seems to me that the prison officials are trying to help “teach” the sex offenders how to “desist” and “refrain” from their deviant behavior…’
However i am not a qualified law giver. To have understanding of the texts you must be taught them by one who is qualified and i can see that is not the case, infact a complete lack of understanding is apparent. It amazes me how you think you can take a tiny excerpt from a classical Islamic manual and explain it away like you have mounds of knowledge. I can see how the Holy Books got changed!!!!
Understanding and Knowledge is a gift!
17 July, 2008 at 9:59 am
* I can see how the Holy Books got changed!!!!
Angela, which “Holy Books” got changed, and by whom?
11 August, 2008 at 9:49 am
There are many Holy Books including the Bible, the Torah (known as the new testament), The Psalms of David and the Quran. All these books were sent by God. The original forms of which are the truth.
It is a undisputable fact that all the aforementioned books have been altered and many versions of each are in circulation. This is not the case with the Quran which is protected and has only one copy throughout the world from the dawn of Islam over 1400 years ago to the current date.
Angela
11 August, 2008 at 10:19 am
“undisputable fact”? On the one hand, you claim that all the aforementioned books
(Bible, the Torah (known as the new testament), The Psalms of David and the Quran)
have been altered … and then say that this is not the case with the Quran, and has
only one copy. Is that the Penguin Classics edition on my desk?
In any event, the Bible (old & new testament) is the revealed Word of God, and
holds the key to God’s plan of salvation and eternal life through Jesus Christ,
God’s only begotten Son, who died on the cross for my sins (and yours, and
everyone’s) and was resurrected, and who will return to reign on Earth for
1,000 years with the saints (believers).
As Jesus Christ said – “Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away.”
Mohammed has passed away; many have followed him to their doom, by heeding a
false prophet who blasphemed against Jesus Christ by saying words to the effect
of “They did not kill him (Jesus Christ), nor did they crucify him, but they thought
they did”. (Sura 4:157)
Salman Rushdie wrote a book on the satanic verses in the koran, but in fact
the whole thing is satanic and blasphemous, and those who follow mohammed
and allah to death remain under the curse of sin and death and hell, forever.
11 August, 2008 at 10:50 am
Angela…
It is a undisputable fact that all the aforementioned books have been altered and many versions of each are in circulation. This is not the case with the Quran which is protected and has only one copy throughout the world from the dawn of Islam over 1400 years ago to the current date.
WHAT FACTS?
WHAT PROOF?
And thats the point there is none…
11 August, 2008 at 5:15 pm
The one book theory is one of the stupidest of the muslim propaganda themes and the easiest to dismiss. :
Human language, word usage and meaning change over generations. I would expect a deity to know that and have prepared for it.
Unless the book (any book) could be translated to any language and adapted, it would only work for the first generation. I would expect a deity to know that.
If a deity wanted humans to understand it would have designed the book to be read by anyone even the uneducated. I would expect muslims to know that.
If the koran was perfect and only scholars could understand it then all scholars would agree on every verse.
They only conclusion you can reach is allah failed to make a perfect book and failed again by not making men good enough to understand it.
It has another counterpart in the koran can only be understood in Arabic. There are many problems with these lies. Here are a few.
Most of the worlds muslims do not read Arabic. If you can not read the koran in Arabic you can not understand it so only educated Arabs should be muslims.
Muslims themselves translated the koran into many dozens of languages. Muslim invaladted their own arguments or once again failed to follow the word of allah.
It would matter more if allah was real but since he is a fictional being it doesn’t matter.
Once again-muslim myths busted.
18 August, 2008 at 7:28 am
keep up good work
18 August, 2008 at 8:05 am
* the dawn of islam
The sun will set on islam, and very soon, by the looks of things …
Georgia, Russia and Ezekiel 38
cbn.com/CBNnews/427240.aspx